Jake DeSantis is Shrugging
March 25th, 2009 at 11:03 am by MicheleThis morning Neil Boortz read this on the air. It’s an op-ed in one of those newspaper thingies we have been excoriating. It’s a letter of resignation by the executive vice president of the American International Group’s financial products unit, to Edward M. Liddy, the chief executive of A.I.G.
Here’s a little excerpt all of the emboldening is mine:
I take this action after 11 years of dedicated, honorable service to A.I.G. I can no longer effectively perform my duties in this dysfunctional environment, nor am I being paid to do so. Like you, I was asked to work for an annual salary of $1, and I agreed out of a sense of duty to the company and to the public officials who have come to its aid. Having now been let down by both, I can no longer justify spending 10, 12, 14 hours a day away from my family for the benefit of those who have let me down.
You and I have never met or spoken to each other, so I’d like to tell you about myself. I was raised by schoolteachers working multiple jobs in a world of closing steel mills. My hard work earned me acceptance to M.I.T., and the institute’s generous financial aid enabled me to attend. I had fulfilled my American dream.
I’m just astounded with a childhood like that he was able to make it to the position he’s in without the help of government funded volunteer programs! Parents who obviously weren’t vocal enough in their teacher’s union and had to work multiple jobs? Hard work? Scholarships? What a throwback!
We’ll have to teach our children that the pursuit of the “American Dream” is an outdated idea, and if they don’t expect too much, then they won’t be disappointed and bitter like “ultrarich” Jake here.
I and many others in the unit feel betrayed that you failed to stand up for us in the face of untrue and unfair accusations from certain members of Congress last Wednesday and from the press over our retention payments, and that you didn’t defend us against the baseless and reckless comments made by the attorneys general of New York and Connecticut.
Like that he should give the money back or kill himself?
That is why I have decided to donate 100 percent of the effective after-tax proceeds of my retention payment directly to organizations that are helping people who are suffering from the global downturn. This is not a tax-deduction gimmick; I simply believe that I at least deserve to dictate how my earnings are spent, and do not want to see them disappear back into the obscurity of A.I.G.’s or the federal government’s budget.
I wish I had something more eloquent to say than “reading this makes me so sad.” But this is just so sad.
Update: Here’s some more thought on the matter, with more links. Just spreading the trolls around, I know.
March 25th, 2009 at 1:58 pm
[...] Six Meat Buffet is sad over the Jake Desantis story and wonders if we’ll have to tell our children that the American Dream is outdated. More Political News: [...]
March 25th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
Well, I was raised by wolves in a world of closing lumber mills. Had to work to go to school and to be what I consider a success. I work 10, 12, and sometimes 14 hours a day and get no bonuses and not a huge amount of pay but not bad, either. I feel betrayed by my (choke) “president” and “congress”. I don’t know the AG of either New York or Connecticut but I’m sure I’d feel betrayed by them, too. If I knew ‘em.
Ok, sorry for the mockery. People’s “hard work” and “travails” stories have never done much for me. I wasn’t raised by wolves but the rest is true.
I do have to say that the contract that AIG had with it’s employees was a valid and legally binding one. For congress to think that taxpayer sentiment suddenly trumps laws is truly awful. He and the other AIG employees in question have every right to be pissed.
What is even more awful is that I’m reasonably certain that there may end up being an AIG stigma that follows these folks as if they had leprosy… virtual paraiahs.
March 25th, 2009 at 2:31 pm
Well, that put a damper on my righteous indignation. This guy got screwed by the political feeding frenzy – no two ways about it.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:00 pm
I’m sorry, but when the company you work for accepts billions of dollars in taxpayer money, not once but twice, half a year from when your bonus is due, it might be time to consider your contract ‘renegotiated’.
Nobody ever said taxpayer sentiment “trumps laws” at all. In fact, taxpayers (i.e. citizens who CAN’T take advantage of tax shelters) are the core of a representative democracy. And their outrage is what has prompted Congress to make a 90% tax on these exorbitant bonuses. So AIG (80% government owned now anyway) can adhere to contract/labor law and pay out the bonuses, and we can then take them back. No law is trumped in the process.
Cry me a river.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
Hello, please delete one of my earlier posts. The first one contains typos.
I managed to find Jake DeSantis’ LinkedIn page, and he lists derivatives as an area of expertise. There is no doubt in my mind that he is being disingenuous when he claims that he had nothing to do with CDSs (a type of derivative)and that he was working with derivatives (which, admittedly can be comprised of a whole bunch of things)while at AIG.
In 2002 Warren Buffett issued his annual letter to the shareholders of Berkshire Hathaway. In it, he called derivatives “financial weapons of mass destruction, carrying dangers that, while now latent, are potentially lethal.”
Working under contract or not, you’d think that an MIT grad would have been able to figure out that things weren’t going to play out very nicely after they started taking all that money. Perhaps AIG (and all the other recipients of TARP and other bailout money) should have been made to RENEGOTIATE contracts just like GM, Ford, and Chrysler did with the autoworkers’ union. Two tiered society, indeed.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:28 pm
I never claimed that I wasn’t unhappy with the bonuses. Personally I think wages and bonuses to the business community have gone into the territory beyond ‘greed’.
That said, I fail to see how a contractual obligation is any different whether it is to a vendor or to your employee for work or services rendered. Taxpayer sentiment had everything to do with it. Congress wants to be re-elected. By responding to public sentiment they chose to rush to ill-advised judgment.
Congress is absolutely not specifically given powers to enact after-the-fact punitive taxes on a select targeted group, which is what this was. Dress it up however you want but when congress-critters all around have gloated (such as Barney Frank) about how what congress doesn’t take, local governments will… then it is a punitive device.
If they wanted to renegotiate that would have been another thing entirely.
By the way: We are NOT a representative democracy. We are a representative REPUBLIC. Very different.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:32 pm
Mike, the fact that DeSantis may have been disingenuous, or naive, does not change the fact that the our government functions under the rules set forth by the Constitution, which got shredded right along with the AIG contracts. It’s not illegal to be stupid in this country.
My point was that we should no longer have any faith that our representatives see our Constitution as valid, and that climbing up the corporate ladder and becoming wildly successful has the potential of making you a target. And I don’t mean that metaphorically. The government has used its bully pulpit to blackmail them into returning the money, by threatening them with releasing their names, politely requesting that they go kill themselves, and fomenting rage among anti-capitalists who are conducting tours by their houses.
The government should functions as my guard dog. It’s gone rabid and it’s running the house.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:49 pm
poor Jake. He went to school for years to learn how to earn? huge profits by undermining his country’s economic system. Perhaps if he were imprisoned like the folks who steal with guns instead of pens he would have something to really complain about.
He is not alone, but most people of the people who have particiapted in and greatly profited from Wall Street’s fraudulent practices for the last 30 years are smart enough to keep their mouths shut in public. Accumulating enormous wealth and power through treason is NOT the American dream.
They process he contributed to stole 3,500,000,000$ from the American people in less than a decade. That’s closing in on 40,000$ an hour, seven days a week, 365 days a year. He didn’t get his share? Perhaps he should be suing his partners in crime and not complaining to and about the victims of his crimes.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:50 pm
I’ll sleep better tonight, michele… I’ve been skulking around guiltily because of all of my stupidity issues.
Founding fathers of this country put as many limits on gov’t as they could because they feared the very things we’re dealing with – intrusion into all aspects of life. They wanted as few restrictions on free market as possible. We’re bass-ackwards.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:57 pm
Glad to be your sleep aid Mr. King! Maybe I can record myself reading some Ayn Rand for you;)
March 25th, 2009 at 5:00 pm
Lemur King,
Our founding fathers argued for years about how to protect the citizens of this country from both the government they were forming and the governance of privately held estates. The protections afforded to citizens have never included the right to limitless private profits regardless of the grossly negligent or knowingly harmful effect of their actions on the country. These people should be prosecuted. Their wealth should be returned to those they stole it from.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:09 pm
DeSantis, go to work. You bum. You’re increasing the unemployment statistics. Haven’t you done enough damage to AIG already? Now you’re playing with our unemployment statistics.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:15 pm
And if I can have my jammies and fuzzy bunny slippers with some warm cocoa… it’ll be just like the good old days that I never had.
Oh, I have an idea… for fun we can pair this up with Earth Hour (seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/travel/2008889064_trearthhour22.html)… we can all have a slumber party and mock non-constitutional politicians and activist judges! Every light on, turn on the cars, start up the mowers, flush lots of toilets, smoke cigars, run shop saws and slice up rare woods, run the heater and stove full blast. Does anybody have any whaleskin hubcaps?
Ooops. Over the line?
Excuse me for a sec. (Cranky… bail me out here.)
March 25th, 2009 at 5:17 pm
You forgot contests to decide who could field strip his/her AR the fastest.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
OK. I believe in capitalism. Which means if your company is a success…then rewards are due. When your company is failing. Sorry guys. No Rewards. But hey, in a capitalistic society if you want to reward incompetence. If you want to give away your store. Go for it.
But when you hold your hand out. When you ask for PUBLIC MONEY (182 BILLION). You lost the right to give away the store. And as an employee you give up the right to your “ENTITLEMENT.”
Nobody is saying that a PRIVATE firm who has not taken PUBLIC money has to limit what they do. But AIG gave up there rights when they jumped on PUPBLIC PAYROLL.
Any Capitalist understands this. It’s the indignant corporatist that are crying foul.
I believe in earning wealth. EARNING it. If your company is bankrupt (which AIG is). Then I say, let them go down. Pull back PUBLIC MONEY and see how all these “poor, innocent hard working masters of the universe” save themselves. That is what America is really about. Hey, DeSantis…Grab your bootstraps and pull.
When will you all wake up. There are hundreds if not thousands of brilliant people out there who can do these jobs. They are not the Masters of the Universe. They are hacks who have found every loophole possible to siphon out millions of company dollars right into there personal bank accounts.
Don’t be suckers. Don’t believe the hype. Do your research. Read. Listen to smart people. Stop giving them all our money!
March 25th, 2009 at 5:19 pm
When a ship sinks all aboard go down, not just those steering. DeSantis’ complaints are crap. He made plenty in previous years from the high rolling gambling of his division in AIG.
The government should step in because if the losses shared by all with pension planning continues the government will be overthrown by future elections.
Michele, the constitution is worthless if citizens are permitted to be robbed by those in the financial community that committed the atrocities that caused AIG and it’s ilk to end up where they are. Where is all that money they received while these sins were perpetrated?
March 25th, 2009 at 5:21 pm
Thank you. You are such a blessing.
I’ll have the wife bring her “Hello Kitty AR-15″.
blog.riflegear.com/archive/2007/12/26/hello-kitty-ar-15—evil-black-rifle-meets-cute-and.aspx
No, she doesn’t have one but she should.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:25 pm
“This guy got screwed by the political feeding frenzy – no two ways about it.”
Please, he got soooo screwed that he can “donate” his entire bonus check. He did not get screwed. HE IS GRANDSTANDING. He is leaving because AIG is about to go down! Wake up people.
BTW: I want to see the receipt on his donation. I want the cashed check stub printed in the NYT. Prove yourself DeSantis. Prove it or go quietly to your next multi-million dollar job.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:34 pm
Why don’t you guys tell folks up front that this site is run by political consultants for the purpose of advocating their client’s agendas. How many of these people think they are discussing this issue with the public at large rather than lobbyists and those individuals that support the position they are paid to defend?
March 25th, 2009 at 6:04 pm
I’d like Congress to request Mr. DeSantis to testify in front of congress regarding his side of the story.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
Buh-bye, Jakie. And take all your arrested-development adolescent shruggers with you. Go set up a utopia where you all sit around in a cirle jerk selling CDFs and Patek-Phillipe watches to each other. No, we won’t be buying anything from you, and if your Blackwater Danneskjold terrorists show up in our AO, they will be shot. If they survive, they will be water-boarded, then shot again.
So have fun in South Carolina, or Costa Rica, or Nigeria, or wherever the hell other 3rd world cesspool you think is no-government paradise. The sooner you parasites GTFO, the sooner the REAL producers can get on with the business of creating useful things.
Maybe all you Rand cultists didn’t notice, but the crony capitalists in Atlas Shrugged were villains. The heroes actually made useful durable goods. Now go, raise your own kobe beef, build your own mansions, mow your own golf courses, roll your own cohibas, whatever. Just go. Go now. Before we get the guillotines out.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:48 pm
michelle and Lemur King: get a room wouldja?
March 25th, 2009 at 7:05 pm
Business executives are the new Jews in Obama’s Mein Kampf.
So an Executive at a subsidiary of a firm decides “hey, these derivatives could potentially be lethal one day – I’m not going to approve these deals any more even though it is common industry practice”. The Board says “but we’re making a ton of money off of them and as long as home prices keep going up we never have anything to worry about! You’re fired!”
Uh-huh. Combine skyrocketing fuel prices that took away extra hundreds of dollars a month that people would have contributed to their mortgages and Boom! after a couple of years of people who never should have qualified for $0 down mortgages under this risky social engineering scheme are going down like Barney Frank on a Fannie Mae executive he was banging at the time.
Surely the solution is to give money to banks to continue making these risky loans so that bad banks who make bad decisions can stay in business against the good banks that were more conservative in their lending practices. What a great fucking idea!
DeSantis’ letter is one that is being played out in boardrooms all over the country. The demonization of many of these execs is nothing but a witch hunt by Fascist Democrats who hope that, by riding this suddenly popular populist wave of public opinion, that they can anally rape capitalism and have massive nationalization of private industries they have no business sticking their crooked noses in.
Does the person who thinks they are doing something wrong sink all of their retirement investments into the company stock in hopes of undermining the company with their practices? It doesn’t make any sense.
March 25th, 2009 at 7:34 pm
Look at all our cute little Acorn funded twatwaffles!
I think Rork is my favorite so far. Let’s see which one of you can trump his “guillotine” line. Sheer brilliance.
March 25th, 2009 at 7:52 pm
Personally, I like G Snott’s comment saying that we are paid political consultants advancing our client’s nefarious agenda.
And we’re using bailout money to do it!!!! Muhahahaha.
I think I’m speaking for everyone here when I say that we are 100% against the bailouts. However, taking my money to pay off a business that made poor decisions and then complaining about how they spent 1/1100th of the money is enough BS to gag a maggot. Especially when we know that the White House and Dodd added the bonus language into that bill.
March 25th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
John G – heh.
Purely platonic and in good fun, dude.
As far as powers of Congress – Madison wrote in The Federalist (45): …the powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined … [they] will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce.
Kind of a re-statement of 10th Amendment. Of course the (ahem) interpretation of said amendment is grounds for (eternal) debate. The problem with taking it loosely is that the federal government’s powers begin to outstrip that of the states.
Rork, you can like someone’s ideas partially, and not in totality. Your assumption that I’m a Rand drone and no-gov’t is unwarranted and pretty simplistic. I think gov’t is completely necessary but at the state level. The further you remove yourself from where the laws that govern you are being made, the less likely those laws are to make sense on the more localized area. It is very hard to effect any meaningful change to federal laws even if your state is entirely in agreement on an issue. As an example look at issues such as right to die, abortion, gay marriage, etc.
Hey Preston… didn’t you mean “shear” brilliance?
March 25th, 2009 at 8:03 pm
Why do I click on your FB links, Holmes? Why?
Who is John Galt?
March 25th, 2009 at 8:20 pm
Trollhammer, your package arrived today. I am eternally grateful. Especially since I just found out that the post office will run out of money in 2009! Your $3 may keep them solvent!
March 25th, 2009 at 8:51 pm
They ran out of money in 2008, dude. They’re living on borrowed time. And it was $9.78 exactly.
And it was worth every penny to get you and all to say… “Who is John Galt?”
Don’t weep for me, I’m not complaining. When the USS USPS goes down, I’ll be too busy helping Merri run her new resume enhancement business.
Until Barack finds us and nationalizes us, of course.
March 25th, 2009 at 9:11 pm
“Michele, the constitution is worthless if citizens are permitted to be robbed by those in the financial community that committed the atrocities that caused AIG and it’s ilk to end up where they are. Where is all that money they received while these sins were perpetrated?”
Dan, I understand the anger. I’m not saying there weren’t any dirty dealings, but we have courts to make that judgment. Then we would be certain and we wouldn’t be arguing about this.
The Constitution prevents the Federal government from becoming judge and jury. When Congress starts issuing edicts, interfering with contracts, and targeting individuals without a trial we no longer have a representative republic or even a representative democracy. The government is representing itself and it’s own expedient interests. There’s illegality all over the place, but there’s one thing you and I can agree upon. We were duped by somebody. You say AIG, I say the government, but it’s probably both because they have colluded in a way that is unfathomable in a true capitalist society.
March 25th, 2009 at 9:17 pm
Dear jake de santis now knowing what kind of Insurance policys that we as tax payers are gonna have to cover and the one’s like if all the ice melts what we will have to pay out that no one has botherd to tell us yet about.Im one of the first guys that would gladly give up a years pay just to kick your ass!oyea I live in springfield virginia let me know if ya ever come to town lunch will be on you!
March 25th, 2009 at 10:02 pm
Looks like Preston and the gang may have made an Obama Action Wire. There are more ACORNs in here than in a fucking squirrel’s nest. Man, the public schools really failed some of these people badly.
March 25th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
Juvenal… Well that would explain some of the nutty tang in the air. And I don’t mean just what I bring to the party.
March 25th, 2009 at 10:12 pm
I hope you’re not judging these fine folks by their spelling or grammar, but rather by their free flowing and ever-coherent thought processes. [/snark]
And these Acorn dickweeds and The Obamessiah can gather together real close, snuggle down and finger bang each other until the cows come home.
March 25th, 2009 at 10:25 pm
Heh. Preston, I guess most of their ideas are garbage, but I’d have to translate their prose from bumfuckese into English to know for sure.
March 25th, 2009 at 10:26 pm
To all you people that are against the person who wrote this resignation. You should be mad at our government not at each of these individuals. The government knew this was going on. Now the politicans come out like roaches pointing a finger at everyone else. The federal government, our congress should not be involved in the contact between AIG and its employees. This is unconsititional.
March 25th, 2009 at 10:55 pm
If you support Jake and respect his courage, pls log on to Facebook and become a “Fan of Jake DeSantis.”
March 27th, 2009 at 7:52 am
Jake DeSantis destroyed the American dream. I have much more respect for Liddy who is doing his job no matter the circumstances. If Jake DeSantis worked all these years for AIG because he really loved what he did and wasn’t in it for the money, then he would be like any other hardworking American that built this country. Working hard no matter what to persevere. Look at all the small business owners who operate at a loss working longer then 16 hours a day. It appears to me he is the very sort of person who spent his life cheating the system and I would recommend the irs audits him.
March 27th, 2009 at 8:09 am
Jaime, get a clue. There is nothing immoral about profiting from your hard work. I realize you’re part of the anti-Capitalist cabal, but drop the hysterics about the “American Dream” being destroyed. You’re part of the group of Obamabots trying to destroy it for good.
If your idea of the “American Dream” is working 16 hours a day simply for the love of your job, then you’re probably one of the unemployed, or at least should be.
I recommend that you be audited, and in addition, I’d like to see your green card.
March 27th, 2009 at 11:42 pm
Mike #4 & Jaime,
Jake worked in equity derivatives and in fact had nothing to do with losses at AIG. Most equity derivatives businesses had excellent years in 2007 and 2008, so your initial assumption is wrong.
As for having a sense that something may go wrong when your company has losses, Jake made it quite clear that Liddy was going out of his way to reassure employees that the retention bonuses would be safe, so it was disingenuous for him to tell congress that the bonuses were somehow illicit.
Talented non-culpable AIG employees like Jake Desantis could and will easily find other jobs at levels similar to or higher than these bonuses, so his departure will be a loss for AIG and ultimately the taxpayers. AIG will repay the governament either by winding down positions or showing earnings power that will allow them to sell equity. The second option, which would be much more likely to preserve taxpayer value, is now effectively nullified, as people walk out the door.
As for the lazy AG’s, they should be looking to criminally punish the culpable losers who loaded the firm up with unhedgeable and off-market CDS risk. There are obvious breaches with regard to accounting and risk related disclosures that fancy-pants Spitzer clearly identified. In fact, had the market listened to him, AIG would have been wound down years ago (the man may be overly libidenous, but apparently certain parts of his brain functioned quite properly).
So Jake is right and possibly overpaid (although he will give the bonus away), but not in any way culpable. If the AGs do their job correctly, they can stop the looting of corporations by showing that excessive fraudulant risk taking is not just immoral, but illegal!
The moron in charge of our nation, set a perfect example of reckless abandon, which was aggressively mimicked by the cheap-money bull-market monkeys who rose to corporate power after 911.
Jaime, you comment about small business owners operating at a loss is nonsensical. They may do that in a start-up fase, but they won’t last long if they don’t turn a profit. That is the problem at AIG today. Jake always made money for AIG, and we are all now worse off when people, no matter how highly paid, walk out and reduce the earnings power of that quasi-government institution. What you are missing is that Jake could make 2-3 times as much somewhere else, that may sound crazy, but it is a fact.
March 28th, 2009 at 12:20 am
Brian,
Your logic makes no sense. Just because a person knows they are doing something wrong does not mean that they think they will be caught. Is does make sense that if you are doing something wrong and you think you will get away with it, you sink all of your money in the stock.
That’s what happened to Fuld – a bull market banker, who never saw a levered bet he couldn’t love. He stayed in Lehman stock because the dummy thought it was too low to sell and would recover. People like Stan O’Neil, Fuld, Jimmy Cayne and Geenberg had no business dabbling in Derivatives much less overseeing titanic levered businesses. They were a generation removed from the theory behind these trading activities, and could barly use a spreadsheet.
They allowed themselves to get bribed and duped into an endless race to the bottom that is created whenever idiots like Greenspan and Bush are in charge. You jokers can try to blame Acorn all you want.
The SEC bankrupted all the brokerage firms and AIG and GE financial in 2004, when it changed the leverage rules and thereby stealthily added $10 tril. of stimulus to the economy. Their goal was to hide the war losses and win the 2004 election.
A trillion dollars of wasted govt. spending in Iraq requires $25 tril. of corporate GDP to generate replacement taxes (5-10 years of same). The country was screwed the minute Darth Cheney decided to spend a $Tril+ to evict scarey Saddam. They then convinced our somnolent Fed Chairman to turn on the printing presses and ignore the asset bubble, so that we could inflate ourselves out of the war. None of AIG’s and the broker dealers’ excesses would have been possible without the demise of glass-steagall and and the combined idiocy of an off-balance sheet war, a fed that ceased reporting M3 and M4, and an retarded political hack chairing the SEC.
You right wing nutcases need to get a clue and ocassionally do some math rather than simply blathering on about the markets and deregulation.
March 28th, 2009 at 9:50 am
My logic makes complete sense, DMAN. If DeSantis had decided not to engage in a common industry practice then he would have been out of a job. Wasn’t Sarbanes-Oxley, the most expensive piece of regulatory legislation ever enacted in the history of business ever, supposed to solve this?
Greenspan was in charge from 1987 until 2006 so you can lob Clinton in with those “idiots” like Greenspan and Bush. Maybe everyone can still ride high on that tech bubble that Clinton promised would go on for infinity and create “unprecedented peace and prosperity”, blah, blah, blah.
What does Iraq have to do with this? Approximately, fuck all. In one breath you want to complain about the price of reacting to September 11th, on the other hand you want to support your Urkel Christ spending 12 times more than Iraq on midnight basketball like that’s going to help the situation.
I realize a leftwing nutjob like yourself might not be able to max out your usual contributions to the Democrats of your choice but I see Dodd on that last so you fucked yourself on that one.
March 28th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Brian,
Add ignorant and rude to right-wing nutcase.
What do you possibly know about what Jake Desantis did for a living? What are you talking about him engaging in industry practice? There were no losses in his business – quite the opposite.
I guess the analogy regarding the plumber being blamed for the electrician’s fire was a bit to complicated for you to follow. (Plumber loike Joe wasn’t – nice book sales though). Now that I understand that you are incapable of following that simple logic it makes sense that you can’t understand that the govt. wasting $1-3 tril in Iraq, off balance sheet — money that has almost zero multiplier effect here at home — could have a negative effect on GDP, jobs, the dollar, etc. Of course you missed the point that the SEC leverage rule change in 2004, in one swoop added $10 tril of liquidity to the system. That was ok for you, I assume if Fox News doesn’t report it it just didn’t happen right?
Don’t you worry about my ability to contribute to sane people — I actually paid attention to the idiot monkey president’s actions and much like Jake, managed to make money in the crisis.
You go ahead and continue living in your fantasy angry white guy bubble of right wing dogma, and people will ignore you. It seems you must still have candles burning in yur McCain Palin shrine. That’s ok, I’m sure Michael Steele will right the ship.
Just kick back and continue to think your angry thoughts and hopefully the rescue will get you back to full-emplyoyment soon! Thanks for the profanity, it really adds to the image. You might want to shower and put on pants once a week rather than sitting around in the same pair of underwear and screaming.
March 28th, 2009 at 11:52 am
You got it, Mahmoud. Don’t blow up any Jewish synagogues on your way to the ANSWER rally.
March 28th, 2009 at 12:05 pm
Good one Bri! No profanity – that’s progress. Now, about that anger thing.
March 28th, 2009 at 12:27 pm
Expect that around the time BofA/Merrill return the bailout and in the interim on stopping bonuses to the bailout recipients who caused this mess.
I’m positive Obama would want it that way. Peace be upon him.
March 28th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
I was going to argue at length about the Iraq thing but shit, DMAN, if we can’t stay on topic for the serious part of the discussion, go make your own post somewhere and stroke out.
*** “You right wing nutcases need to get a clue and ocasionally do some math rather than simply blathering on about the markets and deregulation.”
*** “A trillion dollars of wasted govt. spending in Iraq requires $25T of corporate GDP to generate replacement taxes (5-10 years of same).”
But what the hell, I’m a good sport, I’ll try to do some math but keep it a little closer to home than Iraq.
By wasted govt spending I’m going to assume you mean “things I don’t like or think have any value”. Takes $25 trillion to cover $1 trillion you don’t like, huh?
Our president(s) and congress are spraying diesel on an apartment building fire then. Last estimates I heard we were up around $7 trillion and climbing – at 25:1 that means…. $175 trillion in corporate GDP? Or over ten years $17.5T per annum? Either you are smoking something or I’d better start, because there’s no way in hell that would be paid for without slashing entitlements to zero and raising taxes by some truly math-ey amount. If you did both those things to that extreme at the same time, the economy would tank. US total GDP was ~$14T in 2007…
But wait, we’re raising taxes and entitlements at the same time. I’m not seeing much hope of change or chance of peace and prosperity.
My point is – by your mathematics, or even different and correct mathematics, which is more criminal: AIG or the politicians that think we can spend our way out of this?
My catty rejoinder: You leftwing nutjobs need to get a clue and occasionally use a spell-checker.
March 28th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
Screw math. Screw the blame game.
The house is on fire and everyone is running around calling each other an arsonist in all kinds of creative and complex ways. I don’t understand how this is a left/right argument.
Let’s put this very simply again in the context of principles.
Jake is just the icon of the American achiever. He started small, moved up with brain power and hard work. Got into a business where he would have the opportunity to make a lot of money. He operated within the law top make this money. He heard that his company was in trouble thought about bailing but the promised that it would honor his contract, so he continued. Then the government got involved. Again he heard his contract was safe and went on doing whatever it was that he did. Finally he got the massive bonus he was promised. Then he was told he had to give it back or he should kill himself, but even if he did that, his life was at risk anyway. But before he even had a choice about that the Federal Government and the State Government voted to tax him at 90%.
He was targeted as an individual without a trial, his contract was nullified by the government that had to make an ex post facto law to do this, and his life was endangered by the very folks we put into power to provide for our defense.
So what if he was a regular guy that all of this happened to? What if he had a regular job with a regular bonus? What if he didn’t go to MIT? Are all men really created equal and subject to the same laws? At what point in climbing the ladder are our civil rights up for a vote?
Am I really a right wing nut job? Really? Is there anything irrational about what I just wrote?
March 28th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
The math was to reduce the problem to one of pointing out the ridiculous. Reducto ad absurdum. Or something like that. Truthfully it didn’t even address the original premise, though.
Your point, michele, is the key to the matter, IMHO.
At some point it was decided that it was wrong to be wildly successful and that the more successful you are the more you should pay for the rest.
Did he break a law? Yes or no. If yes, take him to court like Lay or Madoff. If no, it means he stayed within the laws. People can bitch all they want about his “heinous actions” but at the end of the day your sole recourse is only to change the laws for the future. To try to change the rules mid-game is great for Calvin-Ball or 3rd grade but doesn’t belong here.
“At what point in climbing up the ladder are our civil rights up for a vote?” is excellently worded and the correct question.
And no, I don’t want or need to rent a room here. Sorry michele, no offense.
March 30th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
For what it is worth, I just had lunch with Jake. I’m a non-business friend of his in the town where he lives.
I have great respect for him. He is a very smart, humble, non-assuming person who gives back and tries to live responsibly. He happens to even drive a Prius (complete with an environmental bumper sticker, for that matter). He isn’t one of those guys that flaunts his good fortune.
He was trained at MIT as an engineer, and because of his smarts and hard work (and a little bit of luck) ended up in positions where he was visible, earning him a large salary/bonus combination.
I agree with Michele’s excellent wording: “At what point in climbing the (corporate) ladder are our civil rights up for a vote?”
Am I mistaken in remembering that the behavior of our lawmakers in putting aside the legal contracts to level the (income) playing field is akin to Communism?? I thought there was a time when we were much against this behavior. Is that what is next?
I’m an entrepreneur that sometimes struggles to make payroll when things are tough in our economy. I signed up for my lot in life knowing I can make it BIG or I could fail. Should I now worry that if I make it big I could be a target of my fellow countrymen and be forced to give back the extra that I earn? Is there an upper limit for those in our country above which is not reasonable? Who decides this?
Is this becoming a have/have-not discussion? Is this the new political divide instead of abortion, gun control and religious zealotry?
ENOUGH. Leave them alone. A contract is a contract and we have no business breaking it.
And someone please take Cuomo and Blumenthal out back for a good old fashioned whipping. They have no business acting under mob rule like they have been doing. They will some day wake up and realize how embarrassing their behavior has been… doing whatever it takes to get themselves re-elected.
(Am I still allowed to say things like this? Or will I be penalized for speaking my first-amendment mind?)
March 30th, 2009 at 3:48 pm
You can say whatever you want ’round these parts, Michael (as is obvious from the comments of some of the ass clowns in this thread).
The Marxists in charge of government are using class warfare to vilify hard-working folks like Jake. Unfortunately, their Fascist tendencies means that we won’t be able to speak our minds for much longer.
March 30th, 2009 at 4:05 pm
As far as I can tell, the normal rules are suspended, so I wouldn’t make too much of our first-amendment rights any more. When the prez has the free-pass to tell a company CEO to step down, something is seriously wrong.
As if that wasn’t obvious by punitive taxation of contractual obligations.
If you’d told me six months ago that it would be this bad, and so soon, I’d have called you a fearmonger. Now, I’d say you must have had finely-honed prescient abilities.